God, Religion, the Universe and Everything

[JohnnyUtahFBI]

Okay....yes yes Debaser has returned!!! wow twice in one day??? wtf??? and smiley one if i didn't kno any better i would think you were patronizing me....but if you were or weren't it wouldn't phase me in the least either way. wtf is up with the balls line anyway? lol did ya make another trip to the dentist??? lol you don't want Debaser to come out and really 'play' do ya? cause Debaser plays a lot!!!

That being said, like i stated in my original post I don't care what your faith is and how strong your faith is...just keep it away from me....and when i say 'you' I don't mean smileyone or Calena or anyone else..i'm talking about the people in my life here in my area of the world! I've tried and tried to put up with their attempts to make me like them all religious and churchgoing and all...and they have failed! miserably! I was raised Catholic...strict Catholic....kneel on brromsticks and pray Catholic if ya kno what i mean!!!! I changed because of certain events that occured during my life, but the same people meaning my relatives, friends, etc. have not. I do not believe in anything but myself. They all think that I am 'evil' but I have done nothing to reinforce their opinions about me. They constantly hound me to join them in prayer or go to church but I refuse. But they are persistent like mosquitos, you swat them away...but they just keep coming back! Haven't found the right bug spray yet, but when I do, I'll let you all kno meaning you all here in this thread know.

Why do I always feel like I have to explain myself??? As 'they' would say "Jesus, Mary and Joseph!!!!!!"

to reiterate...nothin against all you on BuddyTV...i just need to vent and I do it here cause i'm sick and tired of doing it out there....MINDS ARE MADE UP

do ya get me?

lemme kno

now, Debaser goes to 'play' right smiley??? LMAO

[smileyone]

Ahhhh Debaser... Smiley luvs ya <------------THIS MUCH-------------> always...
You know that

I was not patronising you at all.... You little cupcake!!!

I was raised Catholic...strict Catholic....kneel on brromsticks and pray Catholic if ya kno what i mean!!!! I changed because of certain events that occured during my life, but the same people meaning my relatives, friends, etc. have not. I do not believe in anything but myself. They all think that I am 'evil' but I have done nothing to reinforce their opinions about me. They constantly hound me to join them in prayer or go to church but I refuse. But they are persistent like mosquitos, you swat them away...but they just keep coming back! Haven't found the right bug spray yet, but when I do, I'll let you all kno meaning you all here in this thread know.

Why do I always feel like I have to explain myself??? As 'they' would say "Jesus, Mary and Joseph!!!!!!"

to reiterate...nothin against all you on BuddyTV...i just need to vent and I do it here cause i'm sick and tired of doing it out there....MINDS ARE MADE UP

I know what you mean about the Catholic stronghold.... Oh my Lordy... that's a strong one..... I have not quite found the right bug spray either...

now, Debaser goes to 'play' right smiley??? LMAO

Bet that little clip has been in your head all day.... now you have a glimpse of what early Smiley life was like!!!!
You had to know there had to be a reason for all my insanity.....
I'm about tonight... chat to you later


There is a cracking footie game on TV at the moment.... A charity England 11[ mix of celebs & professional footballers] against ROW [Rest of World 11 [celebs & Professionals],.... less then a minute into second half and ROW have just scored... Celebs include actors... Hugo Speer, some californian guy who was in SATC, bloke who played Issac Mendez in Heroes... as well as Chef Gordon Ramsey and a couple of singers and comedians... One of the guys from Westlife, Gareth Gates and some other chap... amongst others etc... International footballers include Figo, Romario, Di Canio, Jaap Stam, Shearer, Sheringham & David Seaman. Brian Lara & a couple of rugby players are also on the teams! Biggest cheer of the night so far was when the SATC guy, who I believed got it on with Kim what's her face in it... put a goal past Seaman!!! As I said cracking game!!!! 2-3 to ROW at the moment!!!
I will have one eye on my TV for the next while.!!!
All proceeds from this game go to Unicef Charity!!!!

That guy who plays Issac Mendez part in Heroes is running circles around the professional footballers.... He's so close to scoring a goal... I can feel it!!! Fit guy....

Damn it... Shearer has just equilised for England again..... Oh Lordy...

Ohhh now... actor who plays Draco Malfoy in Harry Potter is also now on... as is singer Craid David.... .... As I said cracking line up!!!

Oh now some actor from Lost has come on to play.... Best man not a footballer professional on the field by far is the guy from Heroes.... I am glued to this game and not a soul is on here to chat to me about it.... humbug to the lot of you....

Oh boy.... Craig David actually got man of the match..... Heroes bloke was well robbed!!! ...

[Calena]

I was raised Catholic...strict Catholic....kneel on brromsticks and pray Catholic if ya kno what i mean!!!!

Be assured of my sympathy. That among other things, is exactly what Dawkins is talking about when he says raising kids religious is child abuse.
I was raised Catholic too, but a more liberal version of it.

The thing about atheists is, they don't recruit. Which may be a mistake, seeing as the religious people are highly organized and therefore a force to be reckoned with in political and sociological areas. In my theory atheists are mostly indiviualists who don't need that feeling of being part of a group and who pride themselves in thinking for themselves. Of course atheists have different opinions on topics, it's not like all of them have the same opinion to say, stem-cell research or tax rates, so it's difficult to organize them even if you wanted to.
My point being, debaser, you don't have to fear me trying to convert you to anything, but from their POV it's only logical that they preach to you. I respect you for withstanding their attempts at brainwashing you!

That said, what is this mysterious ball game????

[GuardianAngel1]

Originally Posted by Calena

I so should be doing other things!

Me too! I'm back, did ya miss me?

Originally Posted by Calena

But people personally experienced that Elvis is alive! I mean, fossils prove evolution, yet you don’t accept it. Why should the Elvis lovers accept any proof of that sort? It’s quite arrogant of you to say only what you imagine to be true is true.

I will address the latter part of this statement momentarily. As for the first part:
On the contrary, I believe that fossil evidence proves a lot! For instance, according to the evolutionary theory, for even one species to change into another there would have to be thousands upon thousands of intermediary stages of development (by your own admission, evolution is an ongoing process that takes a long time), however there is little to no fossil evidence of any intermediary stages of even one species developmental evolution (i.e. humans). Not only that, we have fossil evidence that has been proven accurate
that dinosaurs and man lived together.

Originally Posted by Calena

FSM is Flying Spaghetti Monster. It has a book, too, the Gospel of the Flying Spahgetti Monster, which I own.
This will help you to learn more about it:
http://www.venganza.org/about/open-letter/
Pastafarianism made easy:
http://www.venganza.org/flash/guidet...mpreloaded.swf
So, can you disprove anything it says? Anything at all?

Okay, here is where we enter the truly philosophical discussion (you ready?)
*ahem*
Accoding to scientific logical principle, there is no way to either prove that anything exists...such as God. By the same logical standards, there is also no way to disprove that anything exists...such as your FSM.
So, then, how to be know what is and what is not?
So glad you asked!
According to these logical principles, we can only "prove" things by assuming they are or are not real based on varying degrees of probability. Thus we have this:
According to scholars of all eras (regardless of religious background or lack thereof) the continued accuracy and reliability of the Bible, as an ancient text, is astounding as compared to every other ancient text known to mankind. It is equally astounding to them how over 40 authors managed to come up with a text that is as consistent as the Bible is in the first place. Disregarding all of that, we have the term "general revelation" which is the term used to describe the fact that people of every educational level can see from the order and complexity of the universe, that it is far more probable that intelligent design was involved. Even disregarding that we still have an 85% probability factor that through the lack of evidence to the contrary, it is the far more logical and probable answer that there is an intelligent designer. And therefore, using standard scientific logical principles, we have the conclusion that God is proven through probability, and that your FSM does not, also through probability.
Nice try though...

Originally Posted by Calena

Now read the text again and insert humans instead of Babel fish:
“ Now it is such a bizarrely improbable coincidence that anything so mind-bogglingly useful could have evolved purely by chance that some thinkers have chosen to see it as a final and clinching proof of the NON-existence of God.
The argument goes like this:
`I refuse to prove that I exist,' says God, `for proof denies faith, and without faith I am nothing.'
`But,' says Man, `Humans are a dead giveaway, aren’t they? They could not have evolved by chance. It proves you exist, and so therefore, by your own arguments, you don't. QED.'
`Oh dear,' says God, `I hadn't thought of that,' and promptly disappears in a puff of logic."
Isn’t what I put in italic a top creationist argument?

It is indeed! However, here is the problem with this paragraph: God never said that He refused to prove that He exists, in fact, He proves it all the time. Only 2.5 billion people refuse to accept is as proof, whereas 3 billion have seen it as much proof.
Here's a joke that I enjoy:
Two scientists approached God one sunny afternoon, looking very proud of themselves.
They smirked at each other as they stood before Him.
"Yes?" Said God.
"We have decided that we don't need you, God," they said. "We can prove that you aren't a God."
"Oh?" Said God, with a gleam in His eye.
"Yes." Said the scientists. "We have become so advanced that we now know how to make man out of dirt, just like you did, therefore you are not a God."
They smiled at each other, they had Him now!
God considered their statements, and finally said, "Show me."
One scientists bent over and gathered a handful of dirt.
"Ah, ah, ah..." God interrupted,
"Get your own dirt."

LOL! I love that one.

Originally Posted by Calena

That’s what I’m talking about, only with evolution. You seem well-educated and intelligent, why would you refuse to use reason and see the facts? I can only assume you got brainwashed to believe in your imaginary friend.

As I stated through the principles of logic (which by the way, is not a Christian principle per-say), the facts and reason add up to God. Even if He where imaginary, there is still more proof of intelligent design than of anything else, even according to scientists (whom, by the way, still can't explain how a bumblebee can fly).

Originally Posted by Calena

You say despite being god and almighty and all that, he couldn’t have pulled of The Plan as a female? Or isn’t that rather owned to the fact that society was (and still is) patriarchic?

I'm sure He could have "pulled it off" But the fact was that at that time it would have been extremely difficult for Him to do the things that He did if He had come as a woman, because of the way people were (and still are). There's a saying we use a lot, to explain the "gentleman" aspect of God:
A God that can, and a God that will, but a God that won't if you don't want Him to.

Originally Posted by Calena

Doesn’t almost every religion have prayer? That’s talking to god, right? So that doesn’t make Christianity special, and it definitely doesn’t make your branch of Christianity special.

What I'm talking about is beyond prayer. It's not so much the "Our Father who art in heaven..." so much as the "Hey God, how are you today? I met this dude today..." kind of talking.

Originally Posted by Calena

We aren’t created and evolution is not a purposeful process.

And yet people have an inerrant need to have purpose (you remember the example I gave of the POW camp?). Therefore, a non-purposeful process that "created" beings who need to have purpose flies in the face of logic.

Originally Posted by Calena

We exist, but that doesn’t mean we have been created.

I disagree, even by evolutionary standards, the process of conception is termed creating.

Originally Posted by Calena

Very sweet of you to offer. I would really love to win the lottery jackpot. You pray for that, I’ll buy a ticket and if on Sunday I’m a few million Euros richer, I’ll give money to your church and seriously consider believing in god.
(BTW, I think I know what you’ll answer to that. But no thanks, I don’t need you to pray for my spiritual guidance. According to you being sick means you are spiritually out of balance and I’m healthy as a horse – so I figure everything’s all right with me spiritually)

No, I would never pray that you get caught up in such a destructive sin as gambling, and your spiritual guidance is not up to me. I just offering in case you have something more serious going on. Just wanted to let you know that I would be happy to oblige, although God will hear your prayers just as easily as He hears mine.

Originally Posted by Calena

Everyone is welcome to join. That said, we won't tolerate insults in any direction.
Religious feelings are likely to get hurt in here (not by insults, but by challenging them), so if you have religious feelings and don't want them to be hurt, please stay out of this thread. Whining to me how my posts hurt your religious feelings will get you mocked.
If you like to engage in a civil discussion about the topics stated in the thread title, we warmly welcome you.

Nicely put my friend!

Originally Posted by Calena

Course. If you sleep with someone who has the HI-Virus without a condom, you very likely get it too, unless you are one of those immune hookers candy was talking about. (Doesn’t it strike you as a bit ironic that god of all people granted prostitutes immunity? )

Do you remember Mary Magdalene, how she poured the oil on His feet? He forgave her right there in front of a house full of religious pompous windbags, and she was a prostitute. How about the woman that was going to be stoned? God told the angry crowd "Let you who is without sin cast the first stone." She was a prostitute as well. Ironic, I think that in that statement, He was the only one qualified to throw a stone, and yet he forgave her instead.

Originally Posted by Calena

So that’s a consequence, but not of sin, but of unresponsible behavior. And, to go back to free will, what if a husband has an affair with someone who has the HIV, catches it, and passes it on to his unaware wife? Where did the wife sin and therefore deserve the consequence of getting HIV?
Consequence of what sin, to begin with? Being gay? Getting a blood transfusion?

Disease can begin as a consequence of sin for a single act, and the repercussions of it can indeed impact lives throughout history. Such as AIDS. Sin is something like a disease itself. It spreads, it mutates, and even the unaware are affected. Bu no matter who is affected, there is always the open arms of the Great Physician. Sin, nor Aids is any obstacle to Him. When you say "being gay" what exactly is it that you imply? The statement implies that homosexuals are being, therefore implying that they are what they are as they were created, however, this is contradictory, because homosexual behavior is in fact perversion of normal sexual activity, therefore making "being gay" a consequence itself of sin. Which BTW can also be overcome through Christ.

Originally Posted by Calena

That’s argument from personal experience and that isn’t valid. I believe that you believe you encountered god, but that doesn’t make it true.

It makes it true to me, and as I said, there is no way to prove nor disprove anything (refer to my statements on probability), however, you underestimate the power of testimony.

Originally Posted by Calena

I agree that that’s the way it is. Still doesn’t explain why god didn’t create it another more friendly way.

More friendly to whom? You, people in Africa, people in Russia? There are rituals in each country that appear unfriendly to anyone else, and yet they are quite acceptable to the natives of that country. How is it that you get to decide what is or is not friendly?

Originally Posted by Calena

Still you refuse to give up!

"Never give up! Never surrender!" -Quote from Galaxy Quest.

Originally Posted by Calena

Aside from everything else I could say to this: American Courts have ruled that Intelligent Design is NOT a theory.

American courts can say what they want, it is still termed "The Creationist Theory"

Originally Posted by Calena

What has Jesus to do with Evolutionary Theory? Nothing – humankind wasn’t as far in science at the time Jesus lived.
Reasoning skills are a great thing, but they are bound to reach a false conclusion when the person using them has wrong or too little information. Therefore, with the information available after Darwin, Pascal would have come to another conclusion.

What has Darwin to do with the creation of the universe? Nothing- God has always been more advanced than we will ever be. False conclusions are in the eye of the beholder, as is wrong information. Logic is conclusive, no matter what time period, God exists.

Originally Posted by Calena

Yippey. Of course that doesn’t go for various parts of the earth, I take it? New Orleans is not of the hook, then.
It’s interesting that you give me a scientific argument, like the shifting of the earth axis as reason for the flood, and when I accept it, you renounce it.

Who said I renounced it? The shifting of the earths axis is indeed quite probable as the way in which God flooded the earth. No renunciation there.
Still doesn't mean that God will use it again though.

Originally Posted by Calena

That’s exactly my point! A big percentage of bible texts is not the original texts and therefore not the exact words the original authors wrote down. When you take into consideration that even the original texts were written long after the events and with the personal agenda of the authors in mind, how can anyone think the bible is the true word of god?

No, a small percentage of Bible versions are not the original text. For instance, the Ghetto Bible, where the verse "Do not envy your neighbor's wife" is translated "Don't be hookin' up with your homey's old lady." These version are not considered canonized scripture, but they can be pretty funny!
As I stated, even scholars that spend their entire lives researching texts of all kinds still can't understand how the Bible can be as consistent and error proof as it is, but it is.

Originally Posted by Calena

Persecution for me means things like denying you human and civil rights.
If we go by your definition you are persecuting everyone on this earth who has a different faith to yours, including other branches of Christianity. Not nice!

Who said persecution is nice?
While denying human and civil rights is a part of persecution, a person can also be persecuted in their own church, by fellow believers.

Originally Posted by Calena

In the real world things aren’t always black and white, in fact most of the time shades of grey prevail.

That is how most of the world sees it, yes. I believe that everything is either right or wrong, unless God tells us otherwise.

Originally Posted by Calena

But how can people know before being told by missionaries that Jesus died on the cross?

How did people in the Old Testament get to heaven? Faith, Grace, and Mercy.

Originally Posted by Calena

NP, I’m busy myself!

I imagine so, keeping up with all this!

[GuardianAngel1]

Originally Posted by candyrose

I find it hard to believe that you still can't see that AIDS can be spread in a variety of ways...not just by sexual contact and/or drug use. If I am not mistaken, in another post you even said it came directly from sexual activity....immoral behavior. You yourself could easily get AIDS if the circumstances are right. Say you are driving down the road and witness a horrific accident and go to help. There's debris everywhere....you end up getting cut by a piece of glass that came from the windshield when it shattered. You think go to help the other civilians you are trying to help the victims out of the car. The victims are covered in blood....maybe one of them is a small child...and you go to help carry them out. The child has AIDS....and, again, is covered in blood...which comes in contact with the wound or wounds you have....it is possible that you could get AIDS...and is this is a sin...to try and save a life? NO? Just because you try to live a moral life and believe in God, it doesn't mean you are immune to the virus.

Great scenario! While, yes, there are a variety of ways to spread HIV and AIDS, there was only one way to contract it for the very first time. And as I said to Calena, no matter who ends up being affected by sin, God is no respecter of persons...He can heal you no matter who you are or where you come from. I never said that I was immune to it, BTW. In fact, I am at high risk for contracting two very different genetic diseases myself, but that does not hinder my faith in the slightest.

[candyrose]

When you say "being gay" what exactly is it that you imply? The statement implies that homosexuals are being, therefore implying that they are what they are as they were created, however, this is contradictory, because homosexual behavior is in fact perversion of normal sexual activity, therefore making "being gay" a consequence itself of sin. Which BTW can also be overcome through Christ.

You say that it is a "perversion of normal sexual activity" but this implies that all people who consider themselves homosexual or who have these "feelings" engage in perverse sexual acts. What about the people who know they are homosexual but never follow through with the act? Maybe they are struggling and feel ashamed, so they live their lives trying to force themselves into heterosexual relationships, in which they feel completely uncomfortable? What about the people who are simply celibate and have never had sex, but know they are homosexual? What about the small kid...the child..the teenager who feels they were born in the wrong body...or has these feelings for someone of the same sex? Are you saying that these kids are sexually perverse when they have never had sex? And what if they don't view it as being homosexual because they identify with the other gender and thus don't look at themselves the way society perceives them? There are cases where children, small children still in elementary school have exhibited these feelings they can't get rid of.

[GuardianAngel1]

Candy! So glad to have you here!

Originally Posted by candyrose

You say that it is a "perversion of normal sexual activity" but this implies that all people who consider themselves homosexual or who have these "feelings" engage in perverse sexual acts. What about the people who know they are homosexual but never follow through with the act? Maybe they are struggling and feel ashamed, so they live their lives trying to force themselves into heterosexual relationships, in which they feel completely uncomfortable?

Great question! This scenario is the temptation phase. Satan isn't stupid, he knows the best ways to temp each person. Being tempted is not sin, but dwelling on, and engaging in is. That is why some people are more tempted with alcohol, while others with sexual perversions.

Originally Posted by candyrose

What about the people who are simply celibate and have never had sex, but know they are homosexual?

There is no such thing as knowing one is homosexual, because a homosexual is not
a genetic form of human, nor a separate species, nor anything other than a regular human being, albeit being tempted with or engaging in perverse action. That's the plain and simple truth of it. Now, these feelings can be influenced by others, or by sinful actions of others (i.e. being raped as a child), but this is simply residual of sin, and sin always amplifies.

Originally Posted by candyrose

What about the small kid...the child..the teenager who feels they were born in the wrong body...or has these feelings for someone of the same sex? Are you saying that these kids are sexually perverse when they have never had sex?

Satan is also no respecter of persons, he tempts people of every age. It is not to say that these feelings are sin, but not realizing that they are an attack can lead to sin quickly, which is why parents are instructed to teach their kids to have strong faith at an early age.

Originally Posted by candyrose

And what if they don't view it as being homosexual because they identify with the other gender and thus don't look at themselves the way society perceives them? There are cases where children, small children still in elementary school have exhibited these feelings they can't get rid of.

Did you know that the largest sexual organ in the human body (both male and female) is the brain? This is why satan uses mental attacks for this kind of temptation. These scenarios are all mind-games from satan, weapons used to destroy defenses in both the young and the old. Documentation only proves that satan is a real threat, and one who is not above attacking children.

[GuardianAngel1]

Originally Posted by smileyone

The first bit of this conversation was over in SPN thread... a damn good debate that a few got involed in... and yes, as you said... normally with these type of debates, peoples minds are already made up and generally will not be altered not matter what, but it is still good occasionally to see where one is and to hear others take on it.... We moved it over here when we got engrossed in it and we found that it was getting harder to keep saying... ''Dean is Awesome' at the end of every post....

Hiya Smiley, nice to have your voice in this!
BTW, I love the little part about your kid. This is why the Bible says, "Lest ye have faith as a little child, for such is the Kingdom of Heaven." That's what He was talking about, the unbiased, unequivocal, unshakable belief of children!

Originally Posted by smileyone

Personally, I won't come on here to try an convert anyone over to any religion... I'm having a hard enough time trying to keep myself on track let alone try to convert someone else.... It's an interesting topic at times though... only if you are ready to read it without judgement... people get out of it what they do....I suppose...

I quite agree with this statement. Conversion isn't the goal here, methinks. Just shedding some light in the dark places. Answering questions that might otherwise go unanswered, or for that matter, unasked! Love that you're in this with me.

[Calena]

Just two things for tonight:

Great scenario! While, yes, there are a variety of ways to spread HIV and AIDS, there was only one way to contract it for the very first time.

That's right. Question: What about bird flu? If the virus ever mutates and can be spread from one human to another for what sin will this be the consequence? Because, you know, that's how HIV originated: It was the SIV - simian immunodeficiency virus, which exists in 26 African primate species. It transferred from primates to humans where it mutated into a virus that can be passed on from one human to another, becoming HIV - human imunnodeficiency virus. Not only once, but numerous times. It wasn't widely known before the 1980's because with increased plane travelling it spread faster, but the first cases are recorded as far back as far as 100 years ago.
So you say all humans who caught it in Africa from primates were gay? The perverted bastards were probably raping the poor apes!

This is why the Bible says, "Lest ye have faith as a little child, for such is the Kingdom of Heaven." That's what He was talking about, the unbiased, unequivocal, unshakable belief of children!

Exactly. When the children grow older and understand more about the world, they can come to see that it's all wishful thinking.

[smileyone]

That said, what is this mysterious ball game????

It was a charity football match held annually for the charity UNICEF, that looks after impoverished children around the world.... They always raise 2 or 3 million for the one night's game ...
Two teams... one from England... managed by a genuine football legend manager.... this year Harry Rednapp... and a team from the rest of the world... this year managed by the great Kenny Daglish!!! They are allowed one professional goalie, and three outfield footballer professionals and the rest must be made up from a team of celebs from the world of acting, singing, comedians, TV presenters, Chefs... etc...etc...etc... The below names were some of the big names playing in this match....

It's a good match generally... as usually with these things... like Live Aid etc... the celebs involved sometimes tend to be a little self praising in their quest to do the work etc... The run up to these things can be tiresome... but with this game... the guys who play it seem a little different on a whole.... They ut 100% into it and get inconsolable when they lose! Was the same case yesterday!!!

There is a cracking footie game on TV at the moment.... A charity England 11[ mix of celebs & professional footballers] against ROW [Rest of World 11 [celebs & Professionals],.... less then a minute into second half and ROW have just scored...

Celebs include actors... Hugo Speer, some californian guy who was in SATC, bloke who played Issac Mendez in Heroes... as well as Chef Gordon Ramsey and a couple of singers and comedians...

One of the guys from Westlife, Gareth Gates and some other chap... amongst others etc...

International footballers include Figo, Romario, Di Canio, Jaap Stam, Shearer, Sheringham & David Seaman. Brian Lara & a couple of rugby players are also on the teams! Biggest cheer of the night so far was when the SATC guy, who I believed got it on with Kim what's her face in it... put a goal past Seaman!!!

As I said cracking game!!!! 2-3 to ROW at the moment!!!
I will have one eye on my TV for the next while.!!!
All proceeds from this game go to Unicef Charity!!!!

Just some of the celebs and people involved in this... ^^^

That guy who plays Issac Mendez part in Heroes is running circles around the professional footballers.... He's so close to scoring a goal... I can feel it!!! Fit guy....

Seriously, he was robbed of the Man Of The Match title... He played a cracking game!!!!
Best by far on the whole field!!!

Damn it... Sheaer has just equilised for England again..... Oh Lordy...

I couldn't believe him.... too many goals... thought he would have slowed down a bit by now!!!

Ohhh now... actor who plays Draco Malfoy in Harry Potter is also now on... as is singer Craid David.... .... As I said cracking line up!!!

He was good, but beside the rest of them... He looked a bit lost!!! Good game from him all the same!!!

Oh now some actor from Lost has come on to play.... Best man not a footballer professional on the field by far is the guy from Heroes.... I am glued to this game and not a soul is on here to chat to me about it.... humbug to the lot of you....

Merini.. I think was the guys name... maybe a french actor... I could be wrong though....
Good looking chap though... He scored a goal... chipped it right over professional Keeper David Seaman.... I'm sure he'll die a happy man now... as every guy in the country has dreamt of doing that on occasions!!!!

Oh boy.... Craig David actually got man of the match..... Heroes bloke was well robbed!!! ...

Yep.... As good as he was in the game... there were better... IMO!!!

Anyway... Calena... that is a bit about the game!!!

Sorry for posting in wrong thread... I was just multi tasking last night, reading these posts and watching the game at the same time and posted in wrong thread...