Angels&Demons in Supernatural

[Calena]

Originally Posted by helps

What's? I gave you answers to your post. You just overlook me. I know my english sucks and so my thoughts lately, but you know it's because of M.D.D.,too. I used to be quite thoughtful. I'm sorry I don't come up with good topics for discussion as certain awesome people. It wasn't anything interesting anyway, but don't say I didn't answer. I keep my promises. :P

Honey, I'm sorry! You answered. It's my fault I overlooked it, it's the heat&humidity! I love you, and your English is great, and your thoughts are insightful! Please forgive me!

[candyrose]

Thanks for sharing so much, you're braver than I am! Goodness, yeah, I think you must be the half-full type, cuz I think what the guy said at the time wasn't cool. (Not that I imagine I could've thought up anything better to say. I suck at things like that!) Sure, it's true for the person who has cruel parents, but not for the other ones. (I'm hoping you were in the "other" category.) It's great for you to be able to take that approach, though. If you can feel better from a comment like "Things could be worse," I think you're surely a rare person. I don't think most people do. To me, in fact, it's like taking comfort in others' pain. For me, if I'm really suffering, the idea that someone else is going through something worse makes me feel even worse; now, not only am I hurting for myself, I'm hurting for them.

Ah, it's not that big of a deal. I didn't really reveal much of anything that wasnt already known.

I wouldn't say that it was optimism that resulted in my ability to handle his comment. It was simply that I could, in all honesty, understand where he was coming from. He did have a point, too. I know what you mean about feeling worse knowing others have bad lots and possibly ones worse than yours. However, I don't really think it's as relevant to the lot the observer has. Even if things were all great, the idea of others in the world suffering is still pretty darn depressing. It's difficult not to be saddened by it all and not to think about it from time to time. In the situation you described, for me at least, I think any possible crappy feelings result from realizing how sorry one is feeling for themselves with others in the world have it much worse. It's like, "I'm sitting here, dwelling on all this crap, letting it get me down, and feeling like there is no way out of it, yet there are people out there who have to endure worse." It kind of makes one feel guilty, if not down right silly if the situation is minuscule in comparison to the others.

candy seems to be immune against it.

What am I immune against, Helps? Hm? Whose charm are we referring to, here? Please, enlighten me.

[helps]

What am I immune against, Helps? Hm? Whose charm are we referring to, here? Please, enlighten me.

Ehm, Cookie was talking about a charm from CR, but I'd never use word charm in connection with me. I really don't have much to offer anyway. But I could say that for example Teri is good one. I was generally speaking that you're immune to charms of ppl in my country.

Honey, I'm sorry! You answered. It's my fault I overlooked it, it's the heat&humidity! I love you, and your English is great, and your thoughts are insightful! Please forgive me!

Sweetie, you don't have to give me compliments, I'm not offended at all. I just thought I'd say that I actually answered, didn't ignore this thread. It doesn't mean you have to be sorry. I'm not asking anyone to answer my posts. ;P And again, it wasn't anything special, just answering some stuff that you posted.

[Calena]

You people! Why are you making such interesting and long posts when it's past my bedtime! But I have summer holidays as of now, which means I'll be around longer in the evenings. (Except for tomorrow evening, where I'm gonna see a - wait for it - Bon Jovi tribute band named "Bounce" in Vienna. I'm so curious how that'll work out. I think they will either be great or suck completly). And don't congratulate me too soon on the holiday, my mother has a TON of errands for me to do over the holidays. So no nice, peaceful and quiet lazying around, like it used to be when I lived in my flat on my own, oh glory days.

Originally Posted by candyrose

I think, at least a lot of the time, one has to experience failure in order to really appreciate and enjoy success.

I agree with you regarding the reality. Although the question still remains, if you ask people who have grown through struggles and bad experiences, wouldn't they have rather stayed immature and happy instead of growing by bad experiences?
However, if we do take god into the picture, god wouldn't have had to make it so that people get wise through struggling. I agree with Cookie here.

Originally Posted by helps

And I thought you're a theist. Good to hear that. And don't worry, in the end the Hell can be quiet fun. And at least me and Cal are gonna be there with ya ;P lol

candy will be there too. The jury's still out on smiley, though. And don't forget that we'll have AC/DC to play for us down there!

Originally Posted by ExtraCookie

(Some healthy person wailing and moaning over a stubbed toe while walking through a cancer ward, for instance)

Great comparison!

Originally Posted by candyrose

Think of how many people living here in the US who would feel like **** if they were forced to wear 2nd hand clothing. Because they have experienced such struggles, they are happier with less.

I very much agree with this, too. But again, if they'd get asked I'm sure they'd chose the American way of life. It doesn't make them wise to be poor.

Originally Posted by ExtraCookie

Candy, did a far-out fictional TV show really just make us say all that stuff?!

I think it's more the fact that none of us could stay on topic if our lifes depended on it.
Seriously, the beauty of SPN lies in that you can enjoy it superficially, only drooling over the boys, or you can use it as vantage point for insightful, in depth discussions with like mindend, intellectually gifted people, if you are lucky enough to find them. @ all of you:

I'm feeling like I need to watch some George Carlin now! " . . .He has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever 'til the end of time! But He loves you. He loves you, and He needs money!"

You know George Carlin! You must watch Bill Maher, then. You'll love him!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tRpbkpNpgw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtbarqbKNNI

According to Bill you and candy aren't all alone in being an atheist in the US, Cookie:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tVwi...rom=PL&index=2

I so agree with this one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYW2xXxFVtU
I completely don't get why the moderator guy can't even acknowledge he wouldn't be Christian if he were born in Pakistan instead of the US. Surley that's not that hard a concept to understand?

Bashing Sarah Palin:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2OUJ8ZUTiI

New Rules:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VcJoh...eature=related

Ok, I'll stop posting links now. Just search for "Bill Maher" on youtube and become a fan!

Originally Posted by ExtraCookie

I feel like I'm the only person who didn't go to college (or university, foreigners; whatever!) in here (I probably am!) and am not so fond of my brain

Oh, you are not very smart compared to the rest of us, but in foreign land they teach us to be nice even to not that smart people.
Come on, you know that you have become a valued member of our little SPN group here, and you are obviously smart.

Originally Posted by ExtraCookie

Also, using it regularly here will surely improve it. (I'm sure that's what made calena's so good!)

Nah, I just was born that brilliant. In truth being here and talking to candy and others in English has tremendously improved my English. I think I am not exaggerating when I say I speak English fluently now. Yes, this board has helped me a lot and also helps' English has gotten much much better. So helps, it's a great idea for you to study English, you'll be so much better than the other students and probably develop delusions of grandeur, like you can watch happening to me.

Originally Posted by ExtraCookie

I wish I were multilingual!

What for? If you speak one language in the world, you have made the jackpot if it's English. It wouldn't help our conversations in here if you spoke Spanish or French.

Originally Posted by ExtraCookie

Does he ever make any facial expression besides a glare, though?

I think he might have smiled 3 or 4 times over the course of the series.

Originally Posted by ExtraCookie

jumped said shark, do you think everyone agreed? Do you think there weren't other fans out there who did like it fine? Or who, at least, didn't let it affect them to the point that they couldn't remember it fondly?

That's a tough question. I know candy, helps and smiley agree with me, and as you know they are the smart people around here ...
Then there are people who are not that big in numbers but very outspoken, who liked the idea of what they did, but imagined it to turn out differently in the 4th season. So they aren't satisfied either. So what the basically did was ruin the show for some fans in an attempt to please others, but they didn't manage to please the other, so they ruined the show for nothing.
Well, I have to say that PB for me still has the most brilliant and entertaining first season of a TV show that I have ever seen. And the last shot in the S3 finale was brilliant, great and really made an impact (of course they made this shot totally obsolete with the thing they did that ruined the show for me)

I wouldn't stop watching SPN if they jumped the shark in S5. But see, I'd really like for SPN to be the show that I can recommend to people and sing the highest praises of, without having to relativize it - like with Buffy, it's a great show, I love it, but S1 wasn't that great and I'm not that sure about S4 either. I'd like to say the 5 (or 6 or 7 or 8 :wink) seasons of SPN are the best thing ever on TV. So I really implore them to not jump the shark!

Originally Posted by ExtraCookie

Oh, and I'm not scared of the show without Eric.

Blasphemy! Heresy!

Originally Posted by helps

What exactly those letters stand for? Secret? Smart? Silent? Solid? Soaked? Sour? Atheist club? I guess.

ROFL. Supernatural Atheist Club. Not soaked in Washing Maschine Water Atehist Club.

Originally Posted by helps

God made me a way that I don't care too much about what people think.

That's a great line. Whenever a religious person accueses me of being a sinner I'll just say "not my fault at all, god made me that way"

Cookie, did you know that helps' and my country are neighbours?

[candyrose]

Ehm, Cookie was talking about a charm from CR, but I'd never use word charm in connection with me. I really don't have much to offer anyway. But I could say that for example Teri is good one. I was generally speaking that you're immune to charms of ppl in my country.

How is that so?

[candyrose]

I agree with you regarding the reality. Although the question still remains, if you ask people who have grown through struggles and bad experiences, wouldn't they have rather stayed immature and happy instead of growing by bad experiences?

No, I don't think so. The key word you used here is "grown." If a person really, truly has grown from their experiences, then they don't regret them. Of course, they remember the hard times and don't exactly have the fondest of memories, but once they've managed to pull themselves out of it, they feel better about themselves for it. Now, if you are referring to people who generally had endured a lot of crapped and had not taken another from it, learned from it, or whatever else, then I'd be inclined to agree with the statement. And there seems to be certain view here, so let me disagree: Just because one has lived through bad experiences, it doesn't mean they are incapable of being happy. And, I also have to use myself as an example again--I don't feel that way at all, and, Calena, you know some of my stuff, so that should be a point within itself. Maybe I do wish there had been happier times, but I certainly don't wish for ignorance or to be immature.

Furthermore I have to add something about compassion, understanding, and being considerate, here: I think, for some people, they grow to be more considerate and compassionate. I don't want to be the type of person who doesn't care about other people or who can quickly turn the other way when someone is suffering or in need of help. I don't want to be the type of person who is incapable of seeing things from another person's perspective or not being able to put myself in another person's shoes. Of course, I'm not perfect....but I certainly don't want to be that kind of person. It, in all honesty, is associated with low cognitive development and immaturity. That's something children have to learn, and to think a grown adult is more or less incapable of it is quite disappointing.

I very much agree with this, too. But again, if they'd get asked I'm sure they'd chose the American way of life. It doesn't make them wise to be poor.

I said happy or content, not wise. Anyway, again, if you look at some of these people, they think we are rather ridiculous with our need for expensive, name-brand clothing and having to have numerous different articles of clothing. I wouldn't say they'd choose the American life, because that would all depend on their culture. If they were a new immigrant, for example, living in the U.S., then they might be more inclined to feel this way because they are surrounded by values that oppose their own and are trying to assimilate to the dominant culture; but they would still be more grateful for what they had then most other people would.It's like...hm....take someone who is from money and has the ability to go on shopping sprees that go up in the thousands of dollars. If they are used to wearing a dress that costs $500, they are going to become accustomed to that standard of living and thus expect that for themselves. If you took them to some department store, like Pennys, then they'd probably snub everything in there, feeling like it wasn't good enough. But, for example, if you took another person, a really poor person used to wearing 2nd hand clothing to Pennys and told them they could buy a few articles of clothing, then they'd probably be happy as ****. First, they'd be happy to be getting something that isn't used. Second, they'd probably think the clothes in there are nice, and not of low quality like some super rich person would think. Anyway, if you go to some small village or tribe in another part of the world, they'd likely think much differently, simply because they have different values than we have and have been socialized differently, thus having different norms and expectations of themselves and of others. You wouldn't see them arguing, for example, over who gets to wear the shirt from some big name designer and who has to get stuck with the shirt bought from Wal-Mart.

[Calena]

And, I also have to use myself as an example again--I don't feel that way at all, and, Calena, you know some of my stuff, so that should be a point within itself.

I do, and I told you I admire you, because I am not that compassionate and generous and postive about people as you are at all. Judged by these standards you mentioned you can label me selfish and immature.

Maybe I do wish there had been happier times, but I certainly don't wish for ignorance or to be immature.

Ignorant people don't know they are ignorant, do they? I was generally speaking, and I if you could show people different paths - one where they go through hard stuff and become very mature and wise and one where they lived blissfully ignorant and didn't have to experience harsh things and then tell them you would erase their knowlegde about the alternative route they didn't choose - I still think most would opt for the latter route. I know I would.

Anyway, if you go to some small village or tribe in another part of the world, they'd likely think much differently, simply because they have different values than we have and have been socialized differently, thus having different norms and expectations of themselves and of others.

That's true up to a point. But I do wonder why other cultures, like Asian ones for example, strive to be as American as possible. There seems to be something very appealing to the human being about the fun and materialistic way of life.

[helps]

candy will be there too. The jury's still out on smiley, though. And don't forget that we'll have AC/DC to play for us down there!

So it seems we're gonna have a great time down there. I feel how's lucifer pulling my leg down, so we're all gonna meet up again, I'm sure of it.

Oh, you are not very smart compared to the rest of us, but in foreign land they teach us to be nice even to not that smart people.

Nah, I just was born that brilliant.

Did I infect you with my silliness? Did you steal W.F.W.M. from me? I have to agree with all you've said above. We have special classes at school where he learn to treat foreign-not-that-fortunate people.

Then there are people who are not that big in numbers but very outspoken, who liked the idea of what they did, but imagined it to turn out differently in the 4th season. So they aren't satisfied either. So what the basically did was ruin the show for some fans in an attempt to please others, but they didn't manage to please the other, so they ruined the show for nothing.

Ah, it still hurts to think about PB. I loved the show so much. I still haven't seen season 4, because I couldn't force myself. Althought people were complaining about season 3, I still loved it. I enjoyed especially last few episodes, the finale was awesome. I don't get why they had to ruin such a great show.
On the other hand, I'm not scared at all this could happen to SPN. There were weak eps in PB, but in spn it's only perfect, awesome, less awesome. I think when writers and actors stuck with the show, we can have more seasons. I'd love that. I can't imagine SPN to end after this season. Everytime I hear Carry on my wayward son or The eye of the tiger, I see SPN. There's so many things that reminds me the show. Lines, inner jokes. I'm not prepared to loose it. ^^

ROFL. Supernatural Atheist Club. Not soaked in Washing Maschine Water Atehist Club.

Sorry, my mistake. Honestly this didn't cross my mind at all. Supernatural... hmm. Very creative.

That's a great line. Whenever a religious person accueses me of being a sinner I'll just say "not my fault at all, god made me that way"

I know. It comes in handy, doesn't it. They can accuse us of whatever they want to. Their God made us bad Christians. ;P

Cookie, did you know that helps' and my country are neighbours?

Hahaha. Coooookie ruuuuuuuuuuuuuuun!! The teacher Calena is coming.
So you decided to make our US friend, smarter college girl?

How is that so?

It's just the feeling, I don't know.
I think Cookie could look for better charms then in CR.

[Calena]

We have special classes at school where he learn to treat foreign-not-that-fortunate people.

And a whole semester is dedicated to the people in the US, because they need special attention and care! Canadians for example are a lot easier to deal with.

I still haven't seen season 4, because I couldn't force myself.

OMG! You haven't watched it? I'm shocked. I didn't know that. Well, I watched it but couldn never really get excited about it, although there was some good stuff in it, but it just was all so pointless. I still haven't watched "The Final Break", although it's all over the internet. I'm just not that interested.

Lines, inner jokes. I'm not prepared to loose it.

Of course, but would it really feel as great as it does now to do all these inside jokes if they really blew it big time? Like making it soapy?

So you decided to make our US friend, smarter college girl?

She obviously needs some teaching. Only kidding, Cookie.

[candyrose]

I do, and I told you I admire you, because I am not that compassionate and generous and postive about people as you are at all. Judged by these standards you mentioned you can label me selfish and immature.

No, I would label you as such, Calena! I really do admire you--I love you and you're awesome.

Anyway, I think you actually try to understand, even if you sometimes don't find it very easy to do so. Most people would be quick to plug their ears, close their eyes, and then walk away. I think it says a hell of a lot about a person when they actually try to listen and even understand things.

Ignorant people don't know they are ignorant, do they? I was generally speaking, and I if you could show people different paths - one where they go through hard stuff and become very mature and wise and one where they lived blissfully ignorant and didn't have to experience harsh things and then tell them you would erase their knowlegde about the alternative route they didn't choose - I still think most would opt for the latter route. I know I would.

Maybe not. However, ignorant people are not immune to pain and unhappiness. The real difference is when something bad happens to an ignorant person, they don't understand why. Okay, a lot of things happen in one's life that are not always easily understandable. But, for example, sometimes we do things that come with consequences. An ignorant person (at least according to my perception of ignorance) would be more likely to dig a really big hole for himself/herself and then when the consequences arise, he/she wouldn't even realize they brought it on themselves and it was something that could have easily been avoided had they not been so...wait for it....ignorant. I've known rather ignorant people in my time (and I'm not even trying to talk down on them, here; I can have some compassion) who continually do pretty dumb things and then freak out when all the really bad stuff happens. It goes back to learning from mistakes, if one is capable of doing so. Ideally one is supposed to learn from their mistakes, so they can spare themselves certain pains and hardships in the future. If one is smart enough and if the consequence they suffered was great enough, I'd think the person would be more inclined to be more careful in the future. Also, ignorance doesn't always equate to happiness, like I've said before. It could be argued that some people are so ignorant,they don't realize they should be much happier than they actually are. And if one is truly ignorant and selfish in the raw sense, then how many meaningful relationships would they have? If it's so overt, to the point of being completely offensive or annoying, not many people would want to be around them.

I guess ignorance...and illusion....are some people's best friends. Even if that person were blissfully ignorant, however, who is to say that the people around him or her were happy? What if no one likes this person and can't stand to be around him or her? I've seen people hanging out with crowds on a regular basis, and they ignorantly believe they are well-liked when in reality no one can stand them. As soon as they walk away, smiling, everyone else will go on and on about how they can't stand that person. I suppose if they don't realize it, all is fine. But, eventually it will have to be discovered, and once it is, it would have to be very humiliating, I would think.

That's true up to a point. But I do wonder why other cultures, like Asian ones for example, strive to be as American as possible. There seems to be something very appealing to the human being about the fun and materialistic way of life.

There's an easy answer to your question. For some Asian cultures, not all, of course, it's much different than the examples previously described. Many parts of the world have been infiltrated by U.S. American culture, mainly through the medium of the media. It creates this facade that America (the United States) is perfect, where everyone can chase their dreams and succeed. Look at your professor, for example, she had this illusion that it's much easier here than it actually is, and she's an Educated woman. Even people considered to have more sense still fall for it, mainly because they only see the pretty portion of the picture, instead of viewing it in its entirety. In that sense, parts of U.S. American culture have trickled into other cultures, beginning to blend in with other cultures and dilute the values and goals of the culture in question.