4.22 Lucifer Rising Discussion Thread

[GemMaeLee21]

I did love your quote choices Cookie. ) I said I would come back and comment on them properly so here I am. )

Originally Posted by ExtraCookie

Now, to keep this post ep.-relevant and for the fun of it, here are my fave quotes from it:

"What is so worth saving?! I see nothing but pain here! I see inside you. I see your guilt, your anger, confusion. In Paradise, all is forgiven. You'll be at peace, even with Sam." (Note: Misha's delivery here was perfect. His voice when he described Paradise was so wistful and soothing. He was so clearly trying to hang on to that last thread of his belief in his superiors/way of life and was trying to convince himself as much as--if not more than--Dean. Good Soldier Castiel actually left the building by the end of that sentence. He just wasn't ready to act upon it until later.)

I agree I loved this quote, I thought that he was very convincing, he really believed that Dean could be happy in this paradise. Misha plays Castiel's inner conflicts so well.

"You can take your peace and shove it up your lily-white ass. 'Cause I'll take the pain and the guilt; I'll even take Sam as is. It's a lot better than being some Stepford bitch in Paradise!"

When Dean said this, I practically cheered. I thought that he was so awesome in his absolute conviction, that the angels idea of peace was not his and that he was willing to live with everything that he has done, seen, experienced, so that he could remain who he was at his core and even keep Sam as he is, because he doesn't want to change a thing. This was almost I thought a step towards Dean accepting what Sam had done and moving on, choosing to get past it because his brother was still his brother.

"If there's anything worth dying for, this is it!"

"What do you care about dying? You're already dead."

Wow, Dean is amazing, he had some really powerful lines in this episode. He is a born leader, I think he was accepting his responsibility and really stepping up to take charge, when he was talking to Castiel. He really blew me away.

"Yeah, well, we're makin' it up as we go."

Yay, great for Castiel, he is really growning into his own person, he is going to be so invaluable to the fight in the fututre. He was really starting to think for himself, to decide whats wrong and right.

"You lying BITCH!"

Oh my goodness, how I screamed at the tv. I was so amazed and thrilled when he called Ruby a bitch, what a change of opinion towards her.

"I'm sorry."

Then Sam said this and I just melted and I wanted to give him a big hug, after I gave him a slap round the back of the head "you silly boy"
　

"My dad was a lot of things, Bobby, but a coward. . . ??"

Dean knows his dad wasn't perfect, he has accepted it now, but he still respects the man and prtects his intergretity. I love him.

"What's black and white and red all over?"

This was actually quite funny, even from Ruby, made me giggle.

"You can't reach him, Dean; you're outside your coverage zone."

Where were they holding Dean, thats what I want to know? Out of his cover zone, where is that then?

"IT'S THE ARCHANGEL! I'LL HOLD HIM OFF! I'LL HOLD THEM ALL OFF, JUST STOP SAM!"

Castiel gave me goosebumps, I felt so proud and amazed by him. He is so brave, I really want to know want happens between the archangel and Castiel.

[ExtraCookie]

Hi Gem!

The quotes comments were fun! Yes, I think Dean had the best lines from the episode and Cas's were almost exactly right up there with them. Dean was just King Awesome in this!

As to where the "green room" was, I'm assuming it was some part of heaven! Or Limbo or some such. And this tells me all I need in order to know it was Zach/the angels who altered his "sorry" message to Sammy, because that call got through. But Ruby, apparently, was in on it. She had to have been working for both sides!

I agree Dean was realizing he needed Sam in his life, however he can get him, when he said he'd take him as-is. Aww.

I'll probably get booed, but I--fence-sitter that I am--don't totally disagree with the apocalypse-wanting angels. I mean, paradise? Everyone is happy? Sounds awesome! And those people and families (omelettes) that would die who are good would go to heaven anyway! Sure, Zachariah didn't have to be so smug and crass about it, but he does have a point! I mean, if I knew for an absolute fact, beyond any shadow of a doubt I'd be going to a better place when I croak, I'd say "Bring on the apocalypse!" Of course, I can't get toooo deep with this stuff, or I won't be able to suspend disbelief enough to enjoy the show. I'm an atheist, so . . . yeah. If I think too hard about it, I tap into "What's the whole point of this apocalyptic game-playing anyway?" So, I'm just sticking with the Winchesters' and Cas's point of view and rooting for them cuz I love them & it's more fun! Go, team Winchester!

[black raven]

I throught the finale was really good. Not much action but still some great scences. I loved that Bobby called Dean princess, showing that even through Bobby is not around as much he still makes a massive impact when he is. We finally found out why the Azazel was after the special children but it could of come a bit sooner. Sam killing the nurse was very bad. The angels revelation of their true orders was very suprising. But Castiel listened to Dean which was great. The ending was brillient! The Arcangel is coming for Chuck and Castiel, Chuck trys to have an emotional moment and Castiel gives him The Look . The ending was just like Lost! Is fade to white the next great thing? Can't wait for next season!

[shonenhikada]

Wasn't the priest in "Lucifer Rising" referenced in the episode "In the Beginning" when Dean went back in time.

[Phoenix_Rising]

My memory of this episode is fuzzy, becuase I watched it last weekend on a friend's laptop, when I was very very tired! But I'll probably re-post here after I've re-watched the episode.

Obviously some scenes I could not forget, I for one am so Glad we had Bobby again! Oh and that speech to Dean? I do think, I will always see Bobby as a father figure to the boys and for him to say that about John well....Maybe he had a point, But I don't like anyone bashing John But I love when Dean gets reconition so...Yeah, I'm a lil torn.

The phone message, i heard Dean's message and I was like, Yay! Sam might actually go back now, Maybe Hopefully. And then he played it and I wasLike WTF????

I honestly did not notice Ruby's smile on the message scene, I'll have to look out for it when i rewatch the episode nxt week, It's finally coming up on ITV2! YAY.

I loved the end, I mean yes I did have a moment of. "WHAT THEY CAN'T END IT LIKE THAT THOSE...." As I was with the end of Season 1

But I loved the fact that Sam & Dean were standing Side by Side again.

Oh and how i Squeed When Sam Grabbed Ruby as Dean stabbed her with the knife!

That Demon has needed to die for far too long, Don't get me wrong.

I love Ruby In Season 3 and I gave her the benifit of doubt In Season 4 even though I didn't think the actress was as talented as Katie Cassidy, But that's just me. I wasn't even mad when Sam & Ruby slept together. But when I saw he was drinking her blood? and the fact she called him Sammy? I hated it!

I thinik the first words out of my mouth were. "What the hell are you thinking Sam!" and "Only Dean gets to Call Sam, Sammy!"

One thought that ran through my mind at the end?

The Boys are Back.

[Calena]

Originally Posted by Phoenix_Rising

One thought that ran through my mind at the end?

The Boys are Back.

I agree with that. Actually, rise what may, but the ending of S4 was felt oddly comforting to me, because at least the boys are back together! The ending of S3 really left me grief stricken, although it was clear that Dean would come back.

[Phoenix_Rising]

Originally Posted by Calena

I agree with that. Actually, rise what may, but the ending of S4 was felt oddly comforting to me, because at least the boys are back together! The ending of S3 really left me grief stricken, although it was clear that Dean would come back.

Yeah, I hate spoilers so I didn't Know Dean would be back but I hoped, But I hated seeing Dean like that, All Strung up and screaming for Sammy! That's the reason why I can't watch the finale of Season 3!

[Suzieq1978]

Originally Posted by ExtraCookie

I'll probably get booed, but I--fence-sitter that I am--don't totally disagree with the apocalypse-wanting angels. I mean, paradise? Everyone is happy? Sounds awesome! And those people and families (omelettes) that would die who are good would go to heaven anyway! Sure, Zachariah didn't have to be so smug and crass about it, but he does have a point! I mean, if I knew for an absolute fact, beyond any shadow of a doubt I'd be going to a better place when I croak, I'd say "Bring on the apocalypse!" Of course, I can't get toooo deep with this stuff, or I won't be able to suspend disbelief enough to enjoy the show. I'm an atheist, so . . . yeah. If I think too hard about it, I tap into "What's the whole point of this apocalyptic game-playing anyway?" So, I'm just sticking with the Winchesters' and Cas's point of view and rooting for them cuz I love them & it's more fun! Go, team Winchester!

I'm with you here, at least the way that I can understand why angels would bring down apocalypse to get the paradise. But I'm a stubborn as Dean and I want it to bring down by us, us humans - that's how it is meant. No upper intervene, thank you . But my point here is that I can understand why angels would like to have apocalypse.

[Calena]

I just finished rewatching Lucifer Rising.

I don't know why I was a little unclear the first time as to who changed Dean's message, but now I'm certain it was Zach, not Ruby.

I wonder why Lillith agreed to be killed. Ok, demons worship Lucifer as their god, but I's still think a sense of self preservation would prohibit a demon to sacrifice him/her/itself for the greater evil.

Ruby however seems to really have had feelings for Sam, promising him great rewards for what he did.

And to everyone who thinks new Ruby's acting skills lack, I don't know what you are complaining about. She delivered the "I'm awesome speech" perfectly.

[smileyone]

I actually prefer new Ruby to old one.... had my doubts at the beginning, but honestly.... I think she's a cracking good actress.... I'm kind of sorry to see her go.... .....