Alpert and Ben and Jacob - Page 2

g8rfan · 07-02-2009, 06:17 AM

Ben didn't order Juliette to kill the guy on the beach. He ordered her to help the Losties escape. The Others were going to kill her for what she did. Ben, through some arm-twisting, saved her, then she was branded.

You've got me on Cyclops, though. I still don't understand why Ben wanted him to kill those women. All he had to do was stop Charlie, which the women already had under control. After that, they could have just stayed there doing whatever they were doing. I hope the writers didn't work that into the story just to give one of them a reason to tell Charie the code.

Regardless, 'Other shall not kill Other' may be too broad. Or... Ben has no problem ordering Others to kill Others. He just can't do it himself.

Talontbo · 07-02-2009, 09:03 PM

well I am not sure that Ben ordering Juliette to help Sawyer and Kate leave Hydra was anything less than Kill whats her names husband, Juliette, Ben and Big Gay Guy all knew what the deal was.

As for Ben not being able to actually kill another Other... Seems to me he Killed John Locke. Clearly Ben was on the outs,but Locke was the Others Leader.

One could also argue that he in fact killed his own daughter. Also another Other. But this argument would have obvious problems. Not the least of which is, he honestly did not think Widmore would stoop so low.

Of course there is the small matter of Ben and his little baton.

Though it could be argued that Ben up till the Libyan Desert had not actually KILLED by his own hand.

One must ask themselves. How could he have gotten so adept at the use of such an obscure weapon, Kill a man in the desert with nary a second thought and not even think twice about it. Regardless of the revenge factor, someone that has never taken a life before would have had a entirely different reaction upon taken that first life.

Ben appears to be infinitely more experienced at killing and ordering kills than we have been shown. At least in my opinion.

g8rfan · 07-05-2009, 07:07 AM

Yeah, Other shall not kill Other is probably just an Other Law and not an island rule. But it's interesting that Ben said that "the rules have changed" after his daughter was killed. The fact that he said he couldn't kill Whitmore, but would kill his daughter implies that they had set mutually agreed rules at some point. Maybe some kind of "gentlemen's agreement." I hope they explain it.

I think the Others go through a rigorous training program. Juliette has shown some cool moves herself, considering that just 3 years earlier she was a medical researcher. They must have some techniques for improving hand-eye coordination, etc.

kellybee · 07-10-2009, 11:48 AM

Maybe its not about Others. Maybe its about Hostiles. Ben was one of them, he brought about the purge between the two, maybe thats why he has to get Others to do it for him...

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07-02-2009, 06:17 AM	#11
g8rfan Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Florida Posts: 158	Ben didn't order Juliette to kill the guy on the beach. He ordered her to help the Losties escape. The Others were going to kill her for what she did. Ben, through some arm-twisting, saved her, then she was branded. You've got me on Cyclops, though. I still don't understand why Ben wanted him to kill those women. All he had to do was stop Charlie, which the women already had under control. After that, they could have just stayed there doing whatever they were doing. I hope the writers didn't work that into the story just to give one of them a reason to tell Charie the code. Regardless, 'Other shall not kill Other' may be too broad. Or... Ben has no problem ordering Others to kill Others. He just can't do it himself.

07-02-2009, 09:03 PM	#12
Talontbo Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 730	well I am not sure that Ben ordering Juliette to help Sawyer and Kate leave Hydra was anything less than Kill whats her names husband, Juliette, Ben and Big Gay Guy all knew what the deal was. As for Ben not being able to actually kill another Other... Seems to me he Killed John Locke. Clearly Ben was on the outs,but Locke was the Others Leader. One could also argue that he in fact killed his own daughter. Also another Other. But this argument would have obvious problems. Not the least of which is, he honestly did not think Widmore would stoop so low. Of course there is the small matter of Ben and his little baton. Though it could be argued that Ben up till the Libyan Desert had not actually KILLED by his own hand. One must ask themselves. How could he have gotten so adept at the use of such an obscure weapon, Kill a man in the desert with nary a second thought and not even think twice about it. Regardless of the revenge factor, someone that has never taken a life before would have had a entirely different reaction upon taken that first life. Ben appears to be infinitely more experienced at killing and ordering kills than we have been shown. At least in my opinion.

07-05-2009, 07:07 AM	#13
g8rfan Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Florida Posts: 158	Yeah, Other shall not kill Other is probably just an Other Law and not an island rule. But it's interesting that Ben said that "the rules have changed" after his daughter was killed. The fact that he said he couldn't kill Whitmore, but would kill his daughter implies that they had set mutually agreed rules at some point. Maybe some kind of "gentlemen's agreement." I hope they explain it. I think the Others go through a rigorous training program. Juliette has shown some cool moves herself, considering that just 3 years earlier she was a medical researcher. They must have some techniques for improving hand-eye coordination, etc.

07-10-2009, 11:48 AM	#14
kellybee Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 87	Maybe its not about Others. Maybe its about Hostiles. Ben was one of them, he brought about the purge between the two, maybe thats why he has to get Others to do it for him...